Skrevet av Emne: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%  (Lest 210 ganger)

Catalin A

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Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« på: tirsdag 08. januar 2019, klokken 09:08 »
Good morning

Does someone know if is normal on the Nikcometer to show reduced power 80% even  after the batteries are fully charged?
I have a problem with my Think that I can drive only 30-35 km until the meter shows 15% and I don't know if I should drive it to 0% (was thinking that I have that 20% power left on the batteries) and another thing is when I put the car to charge it is charging with only 32-36 Ah according to the Nikometer.
Some advises from more experienced Think users would be appreciated.

Thanks
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elektrolux

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Sv: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« Svar #1 på: tirsdag 08. januar 2019, klokken 22:34 »
Half your battery is most likely defective. Car will grind to a halt within a few months.

Better take pack down for a thorough check.
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Catalin A

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Sv: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« Svar #2 på: onsdag 09. januar 2019, klokken 08:11 »
I did that couple of weeks ago when I cleaned the batteries because I had isolation error. The caw stopped with batteries discharged for a period. When I bought the car the traction battery pack voltage was 19V. When all the batteries was down from the car for cleaning I measured all of them and looks ok average voltage was 6.5
Could be something that the pack need more deep discharges and full charge to accept more Ah?
On beginning of  December in one of the charging time it was able to take 55Ah.

Thanks for your answer and time.

elektrolux

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Sv: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« Svar #3 på: onsdag 09. januar 2019, klokken 18:39 »
A voltage measurement is like a still picture showing only condition at that spesific SOC.

In addition the Voltage must all be within 0,05V from best value.

ie. 15 batteries measure 6,35V, 3 measure 6,25V and 1 measure 5,30V.

Then you most likely have 15 good batteries, 3 that needs more checking, and 1 that have a shorted cell.
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Selger ladeutstyr via http://Elbilhjelpen.no AS

Har hatt trimma City El og Citroen AX elektro
Har for tiden VW e-Up, Peugeot P106 og Citroen Saxo, C1 EVie,  og Berlingo nye modellen, div. Think Classic og City 2010 model, Fiat 500 Microvetti, Buddy og Norges eneste Cree SAM og Chin 3 hjuler samt Vectric scooter. Kjøpt Fiat X 1/9 for elektrifisering og venter på Sort Solo EV #635

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BauDemo

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Sv: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« Svar #4 på: torsdag 10. januar 2019, klokken 16:20 »
Hej Elektrolux,

Thank you for all this information. As you know the BMS does not have information about individual module voltages and even if the voltages are strange it is not something that the BMS will use for that message.

So, to reiterate - the message that Catalin is getting is from the car BMS - the BMS is reporting 80%. What could be the reason(s) for the BMS to report this value?
I don't have my Think close to me - is 80% normal?
Or should it be 100%?
laddplats? -www.uppladdning.nu
nikometer? - www.evmonitor.info

Catalin A

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Sv: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« Svar #5 på: torsdag 10. januar 2019, klokken 20:31 »
Thank you bought for your answers.
Nikolay it is right that was my question: is it normal to show 80% or supposed to be 100 there and if so what can be the reason to show that.

PRensel

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Sv: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« Svar #6 på: torsdag 10. januar 2019, klokken 21:21 »
The Think/Actia BMS uses this reduced power signal to control the power output of the Simotion inverter. Standard settings with full battery is 15% reduced power (so this means the Think was designed to never get full power) and the Simotion expects a 15% PWM signal. When the battery is nearing empty the BMS changes this PWM signal to a maximum of 85% meaning you only get 15% power when batteries are almost empty. These settings can be changed within the Siadis software. My Lithium converted Think is driving with 100% power (with PWM reduced power signal settings removed) and is pumping out over 60kWh a=t 198V :-)

Your low pack voltage is causing the BMS the sent out this 80% limited signal.





 
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Catalin A

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Sv: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« Svar #7 på: fredag 11. januar 2019, klokken 08:44 »
Thanks for your answer.
But with reduced power to 80% how can I drive the car with almost 80 Km/h?
What should be the pack voltage fully charged?

Maybe my questions doesn't make sense for you but I'm trying to understand how this is working and what I can do to be able to use the car to commute to the job around 50 km one way.
Right now I can drive the car 50 km until the meter goes down to 5% but only with 60 Km/h.

Thank you for your time!


PRensel

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Sv: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« Svar #8 på: fredag 11. januar 2019, klokken 09:27 »
The Saft cells are fully charged when about 7.6V resting voltage each and empty under 6V.
Any cell under 5.5V can be considered as garbage, defective, kaput.
When charging the cells they can reach a maximum of near 9V to get them 'balanced' (actually it is overcooking them until they are all even at a certain point)
 
So with 19 cells it is 144V and 114V is empty. Your voltage is under 114V so the BMS assumes it is empty. Probably caused by one or more defective cells.  Located these defective cells and replace them so you can keep on driving. Doing repetitive charges with one or more defective cells will damage other cells also (because the charger keeps on pushing upto 180V into the pack as a whole....)

« Siste redigering: fredag 11. januar 2019, klokken 09:30 av PRensel »
===============
My personal EV collection:
----------------------------
- Audi A2 Electric
- Citroen Saxo Electrique 2-doors
- Vectrix VX1 (in different colors)
- CityEl Fact4
- MiniEl Targa/Cabrio/Basic: red, red
- Th!nk A266 PIV4 (also for sale)
- Th!nk A306 City (cars, parts, service)
===================

Catalin A

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Sv: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« Svar #9 på: fredag 11. januar 2019, klokken 10:04 »
Ok, get it.
I will remove again the pack from the car to test them. What do you think is the best way to test this kind of batteries ? Last time when the pack was down none of the batteries shows under 6,5V.
My other question is if I will have any of them damaged where I can find to buy this kind of old batteries?

Thanks

PRensel

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Sv: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« Svar #10 på: fredag 11. januar 2019, klokken 13:10 »
The way to test them is according Saft specs to see how much charge they will hold.
I believe Saft recommends to discharge them at 0.2C (20A) CC (ConstantCurrent) until 6V and measure the withdrawn capacitiy. Doing a full recharge first. The best way to do a full recharge is with a charger that can detect NDV (Negative Delta Voltage).
This is a lengthy process taking about a day per cell so have fun the next 19 days :-)

===============
My personal EV collection:
----------------------------
- Audi A2 Electric
- Citroen Saxo Electrique 2-doors
- Vectrix VX1 (in different colors)
- CityEl Fact4
- MiniEl Targa/Cabrio/Basic: red, red
- Th!nk A266 PIV4 (also for sale)
- Th!nk A306 City (cars, parts, service)
===================

elektrolux

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Sv: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« Svar #11 på: fredag 11. januar 2019, klokken 16:12 »
You can use the cars heater to test batteries.

Simply take down the pack and measure batteries individual voltage under load.

Stop when best batteries go under 5V

All the rest that dropped off 1 hr before are garbage
Stavanger:

Selger ladeutstyr via http://Elbilhjelpen.no AS

Har hatt trimma City El og Citroen AX elektro
Har for tiden VW e-Up, Peugeot P106 og Citroen Saxo, C1 EVie,  og Berlingo nye modellen, div. Think Classic og City 2010 model, Fiat 500 Microvetti, Buddy og Norges eneste Cree SAM og Chin 3 hjuler samt Vectric scooter. Kjøpt Fiat X 1/9 for elektrifisering og venter på Sort Solo EV #635

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PRensel

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Sv: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« Svar #12 på: fredag 11. januar 2019, klokken 20:23 »
Remember that the heater is a PTC element and causing lesser and lesser amps withdrawn when heating up.
Lesser amps will cause the cell voltage to rise and could give wrong values between measuring individual cells.
===============
My personal EV collection:
----------------------------
- Audi A2 Electric
- Citroen Saxo Electrique 2-doors
- Vectrix VX1 (in different colors)
- CityEl Fact4
- MiniEl Targa/Cabrio/Basic: red, red
- Th!nk A266 PIV4 (also for sale)
- Th!nk A306 City (cars, parts, service)
===================

elektrolux

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Sv: Nikometer shows Reduced power-80%
« Svar #13 på: lørdag 12. januar 2019, klokken 07:46 »
In real life its actually opposite drawing higher and higher amps as battery voltage drops, so be careful, and measure individual battery voltage often.
Stavanger:

Selger ladeutstyr via http://Elbilhjelpen.no AS

Har hatt trimma City El og Citroen AX elektro
Har for tiden VW e-Up, Peugeot P106 og Citroen Saxo, C1 EVie,  og Berlingo nye modellen, div. Think Classic og City 2010 model, Fiat 500 Microvetti, Buddy og Norges eneste Cree SAM og Chin 3 hjuler samt Vectric scooter. Kjøpt Fiat X 1/9 for elektrifisering og venter på Sort Solo EV #635

Daglig leder i elbilhjelpen.no AS. Utleievirksomhet via Nabobil.no, Leieting.no, Avamera.com og Air B&B i tillegg til privat og eget firma. Bytter hus via homeforexchange.com