En Think i Danmark YYCFT26B38J00xxxx

[Orla Pedersen]

Jeg er blevet ejer af en af de ganske få Think med Zebra batteri som findes i danmark. Den har en historie hos en energidistributør, og har angiveligt kørt ganske lidt. Jeg har endnu ikke diagnosticeret på bilen, men den kan angiveligt ikke "starte", men dog varme batteriet op, og måske lade.

For ikke at skade bilen og især batteriet vil jeg gerne have nogle tips til at komme igang med fejlsøgningen på mest skånsomme måde. Og gerne nogle forslag til at finde diagnose software. Jeg har fået opfattelsen at ihvertfald noget af diagnosesoftwaren er givet fri, men hvor finder jeg det? Har søgt på internet uden held.

Jeg har en baggrund i elektronik, mekanik, elektronmikroskoper, og brændselsceller. Jeg vil helst selv fejlfinde og reparere.

På forhånd mange tak, dette forum virker til at have stor viden 

[Orla Pedersen]

Hej igen
Jeg fortsætter indlægget på engelsk da jeg formoder at en del viden kommer fra ikke nordiske lande.

I finally got some time to investigate into the Think. I've got a "nicometer setup" and some detailed information on the CAN messages, so equiped i started out with a new and fully charged 12 volt battery. The nicometer setup was imedially into contact with the car and the following faults showed up.

"Emergency"
"Thermal iso. error"
"Waiting ok temp. discharge"

and occasionally

"zebra temp error 3" ?

The "emergency" pusled me for quite some time as it can be both the enertia switch and/or the RAC-unit causing the problem. It turned out to be the connector for the enertia switch that was the problem.

That solved, a new puzle. Trying to connect the "charger" was a no-go, the inlet socket on the car have at some point been changed to a standard "caravan" socket, hmmmm.... But a simple extension cord was in  the cardboard box with the "charger". I plugged it in and the "charge" symbol lit-up. That is, the car was directly connected to mains.

The fault list changed to

"Thermal iso. error"
"Waiting ok temp. charge"

and still, occasionally

"zebra temp error 3" ?

During the few hours i worked with the car i didn't see the battery temperature rise, it stay'ed 4.8 degC which i find rather low ? But the battery voltage increased very slowly to some 6 volts during the time connected to mains.

Anyway, the "nicometer" has proved a succes in finding the way out of "emergency", but I would like some advice on the next step. Would i be plugging the car in to mains and just wait ? Or do i have to rectify any of the remaining warnings ?

Looking forward to any advice 

[Poppe]

Considering the Zebra battery temperature should be 245°C I would say 4,8 is very low.
It will take a long time  "charging" to get it up to a temp where it will accept charging.
Leave it in for a couple of days and see what happens with the temperature.

[arv]

Batteriet varmes med ca 5 grader per time

[Orla Pedersen]

Considering the Zebra battery temperature should be 245°C I would say 4,8 is very low.
It will take a long time  "charging" to get it up to a temp where it will accept charging.
Leave it in for a couple of days and see what happens with the temperature.

The car have been staying indoor, 18 degC, for a longer period, so the battery certainly should be warmer than 5 degC. Could be sensor-offset or a broken sensor....

I'll try connecting for a longer period and monitor temperature and voltage.

[BauDemo]

I finally got some time to investigate into the Think. I've got a "nicometer setup" and some detailed information on the CAN messages, so equiped i started out with a new and fully charged 12 volt battery. The nicometer setup was imedially into contact with the car and the following faults showed up.

Good to hear of another nicometer setup outthere... If you can send me or publish some photos I would gladly put them on www.evmonitor.info.
Where is the car located? I live in Malmö and visit CPH relatively often. Maybe I can take a look at the car.

[Orla Pedersen]

Good to hear of another nicometer setup outthere... If you can send me or publish some photos I would gladly put them on www.evmonitor.info.
Where is the car located? I live in Malmö and visit CPH relatively often. Maybe I can take a look at the car.

The car is located i Aalborg so.... But I'll keep you all updated.

Status at the moment: a category 2 BMI-fault, and BMI-status 8, and still a red wrench in the instrument cluster.

[Orla Pedersen]

And temperature is rising    Probably after a BMI-reset yesterday. Some 24 hours heating and all tree temperature sensors show 140 degC +

Time will tell......

[jur]

Hej,

det er sandsynlig at BMI-reset startede opvarming. Hvis BMI synes at der er intern isolationsfejl, så slukker den  for opvarming og blokerer varmekredsløb i batterien. Ved hjælp av f.eks. ZEBRA-Monitor S/W kan denne fejlmelding resettes og derefter begynder opvarming forfra. Nu må man bare vente indtil batteritemperaturen nærmer sig 240 grader, og der måler BMI igen isolationsmodstanden i batterien. Hvis isolationsfejlen findes ikke mere, begynder batterien at lade.   
Hvad slags BMI reset lavede du iøvrigt?

Held og lykke,
Jens

[Orla Pedersen]

Hej,

det er sandsynlig at BMI-reset startede opvarming. Hvis BMI synes at der er intern isolationsfejl, så slukker den  for opvarming og blokerer varmekredsløb i batterien. Ved hjælp av f.eks. ZEBRA-Monitor S/W kan denne fejlmelding resettes og derefter begynder opvarming forfra. Nu må man bare vente indtil batteritemperaturen nærmer sig 240 grader, og der måler BMI igen isolationsmodstanden i batterien. Hvis isolationsfejlen findes ikke mere, begynder batterien at lade.   
Hvad slags BMI reset lavede du iøvrigt?

Held og lykke,
Jens

Jeg resatte med knappen nær sikringerne. Det skulle ikke kunne resette en kategori 4 fejl, men det skete alligevel. Jeg har ikke kunnet finde zebra-monitor softwaren nogen steder desværre. Det kunne ellers være rart.

Nu får vi se....

[BauDemo]

Hej,

det er sandsynlig at BMI-reset startede opvarming. Hvis BMI synes at der er intern isolationsfejl, så slukker den  for opvarming og blokerer varmekredsløb i batterien. Ved hjælp av f.eks. ZEBRA-Monitor S/W kan denne fejlmelding resettes og derefter begynder opvarming forfra. Nu må man bare vente indtil batteritemperaturen nærmer sig 240 grader, og der måler BMI igen isolationsmodstanden i batterien. Hvis isolationsfejlen findes ikke mere, begynder batterien at lade.   

Isn't there a difference between "Internal isolation error" (the error you are writing about) and "Thermal isolation error" (the error the original poster is reporting)...

[jur]

Right, you've got a point there.
Just found both error codes (thermal iso and internal iso) in my copy of the MES-DEA error code list (V3)
Obviously all the batteries dying from internal iso fault lately made me expect yet another one. :-/

Jens

[Orla Pedersen]

Progress, or maybe not that much. Yesterday temperature came to 260, but with voltage as low as 317 volt. It tryed to charge but stoped and started many times, timed out, I restarted the charging by pluging mains out and in. It tried again several times and eventually stayed on charging. Very slowly rise in voltage, (340 volt), over half an hour approx.

This morning it had reached 8% SOC and was cooling down...... I didn't manage to  get it heating nor charging again 

Status:
Thermal iso. error
Waiting ok temp. charge
Reach end of charge please
Error status 2, category notice and BMI-state 8, Power up

Wrench in instrument cluster.

About the "Thermal iso. error" it don't make sense anymore as far as the battery heated up in some 24 - 26 hours. Had expected the BMI to reset this fault, but no.

Anyway, i found yet another "charger" stuck away over the right front fender hardwired to PCU and the "caravan" inlet plug. Have to come out so I can inspect the status on its LED's.

[jur]

Hej,

"Thermal Isolation Error" is triggered, when the battery loses temperature too fast (even with heater on). Error type is "notice", but can only be cleared by ZEBRA-monitor level 1 access. As Baudemo has shown recently in this forum, does the charge process also cool down the battery and is therefore interrupted several times for reheating. Maybe this happens now more (too) often.
The 3rd error message indicates that end of charge has not been detected for over 36h of charge time.

Jens 

[stradivaria]

I would start from 12V battery.
Then check AC heater, does it het at all.
Also, measure resistance of heater to analyse it.